User talk:Techie3
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Hello, Techie3, and welcome to Wikisource! Thank you for joining the project. I hope you like the place and decide to stay. Here are a few good links for newcomers:
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Again, welcome! — billinghurst sDrewth 21:38, 23 February 2020 (UTC)
House at Pooh Corner
[edit]Please refer to, for example, Page:The House at Pooh Corner (1961).pdf/14. The "x" in the top left corner indicates this is page x (10). The page numbers in the Index need to match the page numbers in the scan for the correct page numbers to be displayed when the work is transcluded. --EncycloPetey (talk) 04:25, 7 January 2024 (UTC)
- Please note that Index:Winnie-the-Pooh (1961).pdf has a different indexing convention. Please take up your notes with them. Techie3 (talk) 04:29, 7 January 2024 (UTC)
- I have corrected that Index now. It had the same problem with failing to display page numbers correctly in the Mainspace. --EncycloPetey (talk) 04:31, 7 January 2024 (UTC)
- Please note also that (a) this volume has no "Introduction, and (b) we use dashes only to indicate pages outside the page numbering system that have no content. So p[ages with content should never be marked with a dash. See Help:Page_numbers#Page_numbers_in_the_Index_namespace. --EncycloPetey (talk) 04:33, 7 January 2024 (UTC)
- I have corrected that Index now. It had the same problem with failing to display page numbers correctly in the Mainspace. --EncycloPetey (talk) 04:31, 7 January 2024 (UTC)
To see what I mean about page numbers, go to Winnie-the-Pooh (1961). Down the left side of the page, you should see the page numbers. If you don't see them click "Page links hidden" and it will activate them.
These page numbers allow readers to find a particular page from a reference by page number. They also allow for links to specific pages by number, both on Wikisource and from Wikipedia or other projects. If the page numbers are wrong, off, or mislabeled, then these links will not work. Worse, if multiple pages are given the same label, then there is no means to link to a particular page from among that group. And readers will not be able to find a page by using its page number. So they are quite important, even beyond Wikisource. --EncycloPetey (talk) 04:38, 7 January 2024 (UTC)
- Its not that the page numbers are not useful, but that the page numbers are less useful for finding the stuff in the text. Techie3 (talk) 04:40, 7 January 2024 (UTC)
- Less useful than what? For what purpose? The Indexs page is a working page, not the final product. Index pages exist for the work that goes into proofreading, but the Index page is not the goal. The goal is the final copy in Mainspace. And for that, having page numbers is definitely preferred over dashes and repeated tags. Long labels also run over into the text and cause problems. So page numbers are superior in almost every way. --EncycloPetey (talk) 04:44, 7 January 2024 (UTC)
- There is a lot of books with name as page titles, like Alice in Wonderland. It does not have any numbering for the frontpages, which means it has to use the titles as labels. It even dares to have multiple pages with the same label, Poem. I will defer to you for the A.A. Milne's Book however. Techie3 (talk) 05:24, 7 January 2024 (UTC)
- Alice in Wonderland was transcribed in 2010, very early in this site's history, so it shouldn't be considered an example for best practices. And, yes, there are some situations where the front matter of a book has no page numbers at all in the original source. When the source volume does not have any page numbers, there may be more than one way to handle their absence. But all dashes (as at Alice in Wonderland) is now considered bad practice. And when a work does have a page numbering system in place, we use it. --EncycloPetey (talk) 08:07, 7 January 2024 (UTC)
- There is a lot of books with name as page titles, like Alice in Wonderland. It does not have any numbering for the frontpages, which means it has to use the titles as labels. It even dares to have multiple pages with the same label, Poem. I will defer to you for the A.A. Milne's Book however. Techie3 (talk) 05:24, 7 January 2024 (UTC)
- Less useful than what? For what purpose? The Indexs page is a working page, not the final product. Index pages exist for the work that goes into proofreading, but the Index page is not the goal. The goal is the final copy in Mainspace. And for that, having page numbers is definitely preferred over dashes and repeated tags. Long labels also run over into the text and cause problems. So page numbers are superior in almost every way. --EncycloPetey (talk) 04:44, 7 January 2024 (UTC)
Labels like "ToC" and "Title" are no longer needed once verification and transclusion is complete. They are only meaningful if there is not a numbering scheme from the font matter. For this volume, there are clear roman numerals used for the front matter, and those pages not specifically labelled interpolate precisely into that scheme. It is also very poor practice to create long labels, since they will overlap into the text / images once trasncluded. --EncycloPetey (talk) 01:51, 10 January 2024 (UTC)
By contrast (I had to go find an example) an index like Index:Lucian (IA lucianlucas00collrich).pdf benefits from "Title" and such as page labels, because none of the front matter is numbered, and with just the two pages, we might as well use word labels. However, "ToC" is a better label than "Contents" because it is shorter and does not run the risk of extending from the margin into the page proper. --EncycloPetey (talk) 02:05, 10 January 2024 (UTC)